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March 26th, 2010
#11
The ones fans obsess about?

What ones the fans obsess about? Define that term.

It's implied that it would have transferred to Goku when the Old Kai gives Goku his life. The Old Kai had a ~1000 years worth of life left in him, and he gave all of his life to Goku (as he immediately dies right after giving his life to Goku). Therefore Goku had all of the life that was left in the Old Kai, which was ~1000 years worth.

Well, he was a Kaioshin. Since they have longer lifespans, transferring 1000 years worth of life might not actually be that much, considering they live for about 5 million+ years. It's like if I gave half of my life span to a dog. That dog would now have half a dog's life span, not a human one.

Last edited on March 26th, 2010 at 08:13 PM.
March 26th, 2010
#12
"Goku and the others are gone?" Define "others," since I'd be willing to bet money more than just Kame-Sennin ("Master Roshi") is alive.

Nvm that. The line is actually talking about Goku and Vegeta leaving their Saiyan blood with the Humans or something like that.

It's implied that it would have transferred to Goku when the Old Kai gives Goku his life. The Old Kai had a ~1000 years worth of life left in him, and he gave all of his life to Goku (as he immediately dies right after giving his life to Goku). Therefore Goku had all of the life that was left in the Old Kai, which was ~1000 years worth.

Or he just gave Goku his ability to live (the same thing you'd get from the Dragon if you asked for the same gift). There's no way you can just assume something like what you're suggesting with what they're giving us.

Last edited on March 26th, 2010 at 08:27 PM.
March 26th, 2010
#13
What ones the fans obsess about? Define that term.

Goku,Vegeta,Gohan,Goten,Trunks.
March 26th, 2010
#14
Or he just gave Goku his ability to live (the same thing you'd get from the Dragon if you asked for the same gift). There's no way you can just assume something like what you're suggesting with what they're giving us.

Um, no.

It's not the same thing as what the Dragon does. The Dragon doesn't give up his own life for the people that he's reviving. The Dragon gives people their own individual lives back, if it was prematurely taken through unnatural means. The Old Kai wasn't giving Goku his own individual life back, the Old Kai was giving him his own life in order to revive Goku. All of the life that was in the Old Kai had gone in to Goku, which was a thousand years worth.

Goku is essentially indefinitely borrowing the Old Kai's life.
March 27th, 2010
#15
Um, no.

It's not the same thing as what the Dragon does. The Dragon doesn't give up his own life for the people that he's reviving. The Dragon gives people their own individual lives back, if it was prematurely taken through unnatural means. The Old Kai wasn't giving Goku his own individual life back, the Old Kai was giving him his own life in order to revive Goku. All of the life that was in the Old Kai had gone in to Goku, which was a thousand years worth.

Goku is essentially indefinitely borrowing the Old Kai's life.

Never said the Dragon gives up its life. Only that you're getting the same thing. You're assuming way too much. Goku getting 1000 years tacked onto his lifespan isn't something that should be glossed over without mentioning (especially right after Goku says he's not going to be around forever and that the others need to learn to manage without him, but I can't remember if Old Kai heard him say that). Even if Goku was literally running on Old Kai's life force you'd then have to then assume your way through what Kiyza said here:

I'm going to say no to that, because though it may have been a thousand years for the Old Kai to live, there's nothing saying that when it was transferred to Goku it would have been the same.

March 27th, 2010
#16
Never said the Dragon gives up its life. Only that you're getting the same thing.

I never said you did, but you're assuming that what the Old Kai did for Goku is akin to what the Dragon does for people who wish others back to life. I was just trying to show you that they aren't comparable situations.

Yes, both situations do end up with someone getting revived, but that's where the similarities end.

With Shenron/Porunga, when you make a wish for someone to come back to life, they are revived by having their own lives restored to them in the exact state that they were in before they were prematurely killed from an unnatural death.

The Old Kai wasn't giving Goku's life back to Goku though, the Old Kai was giving his own life to Goku. This means that when the Old Kai gave Goku his life in order to revive him, all of the life he had inside him went over in to Goku.

You're assuming way too much. Goku getting 1000 years tacked onto his lifespan isn't something that should be glossed over without mentioning (especially right after Goku says he's not going to be around forever and that the others need to learn to manage without him, but I can't remember if Old Kai heard him say that).

Um no, I'm not assuming too much. I have enough facts to back up what I've been trying to prove, to show that it's a reasonable/logical conclusion.

The Old Kai had a thousand years worth of life left in him. The Old Kai gave all of his life to Goku to revive him. Goku therefore has the thousand years worth of life that was remaining in the Old Kai, since he is using the Old Kai's life as his own.

Just because the series didn't go in to more thorough detail about it doesn't mean it isn't true. That doesn't disprove anything.

Also, that line about Goku not being there forever and that they would have to manage without him was anime-exclusive. He never says that in the manga. He only tells everyone that he's going off to train Uub at his village, and then leaves.

Even if Goku was literally running on Old Kai's life force you'd then have to then assume your way through what Kiyza said here:

I'm going to say no to that, because though it may have been a thousand years for the Old Kai to live, there's nothing saying that when it was transferred to Goku it would have been the same.

Well, he was a Kaioshin. Since they have longer lifespans, transferring 1000 years worth of life might not actually be that much, considering they live for about 5 million+ years. It's like if I gave half of my life span to a dog. That dog would now have half a dog's life span, not a human one.

I added that second quote because it expands on the part you quoted, Citrinate.

@Kizya: If you gave half of your lifespan to your dog, then he would have half of your lifespan converted to dog years, not half of a dogs lifespan. So let's say your overall lifespan is 100 years or something, and you give half that (50) to your dog. Your dog would then have 50 Human years added on to his lifespan, which would be 213 years for him. He would continue to live for 50 Human years/213 dog years.

Also, when the Old Kai was making that thousand year estimation on the remaining years of his life, he was referring to how many Human years he had left, not how many Kai years he had left.

If Humans are dogs and Kai's are Humans, then that would mean the Kai's go by a different measurement of time when aging (in comparison to a Human's measurement of time), correct?

What I mean is that...

When comparing Human aging and dog aging to each other, we each have our own measurements of time to compare the aging process for both Humans and dogs. A year for a Human is not a year for a dog (it's roughly 10.5 for dogs). So 20 years by our measurement of time would be 93 years by a dogs measurement of time.

The same could be said for Kai's, assuming they have their own separate measurement of time. Like let's say 5 Kai years is equal to 50,000 Human years. That would mean a 20 year old Kai would be about 200,000 years old in Human years. So a Kai at the age of 80 or 90 (in Kai years) would have the same elderly traits as a Human that is at the age of 80 or 90 (in Human years).

So when the Old Kai commented on how much life he had left, he would've said something around the lines of maybe having a few months left to live, and then would've commented about how a few months in Kai time is a thousand years in Human time. But instead he said he had about a thousand years left to live, which means that if Kai's really do have their own measurements of time (measurements of time that are equal to our measurements of time with Humans and dogs), he would've had to of been referring to Human years, since no Kai would be able to live for a thousand Kai years (a Kai living for a thousand Kai years would be the same as a Human living for a thousand Human years). Which means that those thousand years would've crossed over to Goku.

Hope this made sense, as I wrote it at like 4 in the morning.
March 27th, 2010
#17
Goku,Vegeta,Gohan,Goten,Trunks.

There are plenty of people who obsess over Piccolo... (Points to words under avatar)

And Nekroturkey, if Goku's still alive, how come there's been no word and nothing to hint at him being in Dragon Ball Online? Because of this, your theory is about as valid as "Girls can't go Super Saiyan," since it seems to have been disproved as of late.
March 27th, 2010
#18
He only tells everyone that he's going off to train Uub at his village, and then leaves.

Never read the manga, but the quote I'm referring to wasn't at the end of DBZ. He said it soon after his fight with Fat Buu when he first goes SSJ3 and it was his reason as to why he didn't finish off Buu right there.

I have enough facts to back up what I've been trying to prove, to show that it's a reasonable/logical conclusion.

Well when you're ready to show your facts I'll be glad to continue this discussion, but right now you're still just assuming almost everything based on an interpretation of the quote "I'll give you the life that's left inside of me".

The rest about how converting the lifespan of 1 species to another doesn't seem to be based on anything either. If transferring lives also somehow combats biological aging then you're just assuming that as well.

Just because the series didn't go in to more thorough detail about it doesn't mean it isn't true. That doesn't disprove anything.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance
March 27th, 2010
#19
Never read the manga, but the quote I'm referring to wasn't at the end of DBZ. He said it soon after his fight with Fat Buu when he first goes SSJ3 and it was his reason as to why he didn't finish off Buu right there.

You really ought to read the manga. It's much more convienient to double check than the anime. Also, what's the quote, and is it from the Japanese version (if so, who's the translator), the Funimation dub, or some other dub?




And that sums up roughly 90% of Dragon Ball fans in a nutshell. Fourtunately, most people on this site have some insightive things to say.
March 27th, 2010
#20
Also, what's the quote, and is it from the Japanese version (if so, who's the translator), the Funimation dub, or some other dub?

It starts at around the 1:00 mark.