|
|
|
|
|
I'd like for you to point out at what point in this part of the post I said that it was your argument that Goku got nothing over than life...
|
| |
|
|
Here's a quote from the previous posts you made (In response to Kiyza) in which you still clearly think that I'm somehow saying Goku gets nothing is a better idea than Goku getting 1000 years:
|
|
|
there just isn't enough info about this to make an accurate decision one way or another on Goku getting a thousand years, or nothing else but life. But someone here is trying to make one anyway, based on nothing more than their own pseudo logic.
|
| |
|
|
Unless, of course, the "someone" isn't me.
|
| |
|
|
You assumed that I was in some way saying that Goku getting nothing else but life was still your argument in my other post...
|
|
|
|
|
But it is as much of a logical outcome as nothing else happening, and should be considered a candidate for being a part of the canon as much as nothing else happening should be.
|
| |
|
|
I might as well repeat myself again as that's all I've been doing for the past couple posts. If you haven't gotten it yet then you probably never will, but I still have hope!
|
| |
|
|
I asked you to point out where in that post I said, or implied that was still your argument. You still haven't done so, so I'm hoping you see that I'm not trying to refute that with you anymore, or more specifically, in that one post.
As for my response to Kizya, are we going to start up a whole new discussion about what we think the other person is thinking, but not sure if what we're thinking is what the other person is thinking?
|
|
They shouldn't be taken seriously because there are a literally infinite number ideas that meet this same exact criteria (in which the criteria is not contradicting the canon). If you take any 1 of these ideas seriously you must be willing to take all of them seriously. If you want to pick just 1 idea out of the infinite pool of ideas and say that the 1 has more worth than the others then it's called special pleading. You can also rewrite that 3rd fact as:
3. It's a fact that when discussing canon you should keep non-canon ideas completely out of it even if it's possible that the idea could fit in with the canon simply because it does not contradict the canon.
|
| |
|
|
I'm well aware that there are quite a few ideas out there that don't contradict the canon, but they are not all similar to mine. There are two categories that those types of ideas fall in to...
1. Ideas that have no basis/structure for their accusations, but still don't contradict anything in the canon.
2. Ideas that have a basis/structure for their accusations that are actually based on something, AND don't contradict anything in the canon.
Neither of them contradict the canon (or can be a part of the canon), but the ideas in category two have a higher chance at being a part of the canon than the ideas in category one as they have an actual basis for their accusations, their accusations are based on predetermined facts from the series to form a structure for the accusations.
You can't compare an idea from one category to another, as the ideas from one category have have an obviously higher chance at being a part of the canon than the ideas from the other category.
Goku getting a thousand years has a basis for its accusation, the basis is formed from a predetermined fact from the show, so it falls in to category two. The Old Kai had a thousand years of life left, and gave it all up to Goku. The Old Kai ended up dieing (losing his life (which had a thousand years on it) to Goku when he gave it to Goku). Goku ended up getting the Old Kai's life entirely. So the basis for the accusation that Goku would have a thousand years of life as a result is there, and it doesn't contradict anything.
And all of the ideas in category two (including my own) have just as much worth as each other. Mine isn't any more special than the others in this same category, because it holds just as much water as the rest of them. To be clear, I don't hold my idea on some sort of higher pedestal in comparison to any of the other ideas that fall in to category two.
|
|
Just for clarity, when i say "the information" I mean all of the canon excluding DBO (as we don't have any information from DBO regarding this and what we do have is just translations made by fans who used Google).
If we get more information in the future then there is always the possibility it will become canon as it does not currently contradict it (although a contradicting idea can technically become canon as well if Toriyama screws up), but with the information we have now the idea will never become canon because all it has going for it is that it doesn't contradict the canon (there is no information supporting it).
|
| |
|
|
I know what you're saying. You're saying that with the amount of information out on this subject right now, the idea that Goku gets a thousand years is not canon. I agree, as we've gone over this before, I'm not trying to claim that it is. There isn't enough information to claim that it is canon, or a part of the canon.
I also get that you're saying that if it isn't canon now with the information that we have available out on this subject right now, then it won't ever be canon if the only information we ever have regarding this subject is the same information we have on it right now, and again, I agree. We already established that it is not canon with just the information we have on the subject right now, it is only a potential candidate for the canon. Assuming this is the only information that we will ever have regarding this subject, then you're right, it won't ever be canon. But you're assuming that this is the only information we will ever get on the subject, which is just plain untrue. While we probably won't get any more information regarding this subject specifically (a straight answer or something), we will know more information eventually that will indirectly determine what the outcome for the Old Kai giving Goku life really was.
|
|
|
If there was an answer we'd almost certainly have it by now. If there's no new information that pushes us towards an answer in DBO then we'll never get one.
|
| |
|
|
So the fact that this idea is not canon with just the information that we currently have regarding this subject, along with the fact that it will never be canon if the only information that we ever have regarding this subject is just the information we have right now, coupled with the fact that you believe we will no longer get any new information, you are essentially trying to predict the future with your own opinion, saying that it will never be canon. I'm saying that you can't say that for sure (you can't predict the future), just like I can't say if it will ever be canon (I can't predict the future either).
When I said that you can't say that this will never be canon based on just the information that we have, I meant that you can't seriously imply that we won't ever get any more information on this subject, or any more information that will indirectly affect this subject that will help prove if this idea is canon or not, or at least end up giving us more details that would better equip us to say if this idea is more likely than not to be canon/non-canon.
Like I said, the lore of DBO is incomplete, and there will inevtiably be more added to it. We will eventually know for sure the fate of Goku, and when we do, it will indirectly affect this subject by giving us an answer regarding this subject.
104
